Demnos
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posted on 9-5-2003 at 04:44 PM
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The new ***** rating system: Review!
Finally its here, the most highly anticipated new feature in a long time - the new rating system. First impression: Its perfect!!!
Seems like Audiosoft did exactly what we discussed here, well, almost.
You have 5 stars that are displayed for every track and initially, are all empty. You can click on any star and even on a half-star, so ratings from 0
- 10 are possible by a simple click. In the editor, you can see that this 0 - 10 really corresponds to 0 - 100, and you can use the keyboard to enter
the "inbetween" ratings like 57.
Then in autoplay mode, you can select the min and max values to be played.
Ratings are stored inside the MP3 File itself (in an ID3V2 User Text tag with "asnrating=00".) so there is a noticable, but bearable delay
when clicking on NEXT SONG right after you modified a rating (at least if you get your songs over a WLAN network like I do).
A few things are still missing:
1) You can not select a playmode where all unrated songs are played. Even though "unrated" looks on screen the same as "zero
stars", it is not. Selecting all songs with "zero stars" will only play back those, no unrated ones.
2) Unfortunately, there is no way to query the database to display songs with certain rating. Today we have GENRE, YEAR and even POPULARITY, so a
RATING tab would be needed. So, rating currently only works for the Autoplay modes. But it would be so much better if you could tell eJukebox to
display "all songs with 3 or more stars" and then manually select some of them to your playlist. Requested Feature!
3) There is a hybrid playback mode for combining the rating system with the popularity system. Hybrid means in this case a "logical OR", as
in "play all songs that have rating X OR popularity Y. This is probably the most useful mode, but it would be nice to see a mode "play me
all songs with rating X AND popularity Y".
Points 1 and 3 are probably not that important, but point 2 is a must, I think.
But already, the rating feature is so impressive, THANKS AUDIOSOFT!!!!!
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jhlurie
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posted on 9-5-2003 at 11:29 PM
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It is indeed an impressive start. You are correct that more can always be done with USING the ratings, but entering them is just as we'd hashed
it out.
In the long term, this is going to make eJ so much more powerful.
A big big congratulations for a job well done.
EDIT - Looking at the 5-star and hybrid play modes, that's pretty well implemented from our discussions too. I see your point about the AND/OR
thing, but think the "control" for that might be a bit tough to visualize.
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jhlurie
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posted on 9-6-2003 at 12:01 AM
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A possible future enhancement--a minor visual tweak which could be neat--would be to use floating text when the mouse is positioned over the star
rating to show the "exact" rating, assuming one has been defined. Then again, I haven't seen floating text used elsewhere in eJ, so
I'm making a big assumption that its possible with the tools Audiosoft has used. Also, obviously it's only worth it if there is no
performance penalty involved, and that it doesn't confuse the motion of the mouse when adjusting the rating.
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Audiosoft
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posted on 9-6-2003 at 03:43 AM
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Glad you all are enjoying the new 5 star rating system. 
| Quote: |
1) You can not select a playmode where all unrated songs are played. Even though "unrated" looks on screen the same as "zero
stars", it is not. Selecting all songs with "zero stars" will only play back those, no unrated ones.
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Demons,
Actually we made sure it was possible to play ALL unrated songs - mainly so that you can easily set the rating one after the other.
All you have to do is turn off Hybrid mode...Select 5 Star mode...and clear both the ratings number boxes so they are blank.
If you want it to select unrated songs based on the pick count settings and at the same time use the star rating settings to select rated songs just
turn Hybrid mode on.
 Audiosoft |
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jhlurie
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posted on 9-6-2003 at 04:11 AM
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Hey that's cool, Audiosoft!
One nitpick I just thought of. While the look of the Rating panel in the Edit screen is Ultra Cool, one minor issue is that the white box for the
numeric score is a bit too close in color to the light grey surrounding it. Somebody who wasn't looking for it might not see it.
Wow I feel like a dork. I actually used the word "Cool" twice in a single post. 
On another topic... any plans to eventually adjust the main area which displays the artist/song/album listings to also display the ratings? I'm
certainly not expecting a change that big any time soon... but next time you do a big redesign it could work...
BTW: the skinnability on those screens is sweet (see, I avoided "cool". Any plans to expand that capability eventually? Pirk and I may be at odds with the auto-rating, but I think we'd both love to see the skins
taken even further... dare I suggest... to the "Now Playing panel?" 
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Pirk
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posted on 9-6-2003 at 12:49 PM
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| Quote: | Message original : jhlurie
On another topic... any plans to eventually adjust the main area which displays the artist/song/album listings to also display the ratings? I'm
certainly not expecting a change that big any time soon... but next time you do a big redesign it could work... |
Yes, very good idea!
That agree with my "faded stars" idea on second thoughts. See my latest post.
| Quote: | Message original : jhlurie
BTW: the skinnability on those screens is sweet (see, I avoided "cool". Any plans to expand that capability eventually? Pirk and I may be at odds with the auto-rating, but I think we'd both love to see the skins
taken even further... dare I suggest... to the "Now Playing panel?" |
2nd great idea! That's true, I hope that too.
Pirk |
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Pirk
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posted on 9-7-2003 at 07:14 PM
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Well, after a quite undecided weekend, I start to get used to rate my songs... The planned stars attraction seems to work. 
But I don't know if I will be able to persevere until I overcome ratings of all my songs. The prospects for great result should encourage me,
well I hope!
The only thing is I cannot do my ratings elsewhere than in front of my screen... It's too restricting!
Demnos, jhlurie do you always stay in front of your screen to do this work?
Also, I wait for the "point 2" requested by Demnos!
Thanks for the 5 stars Audiosoft!
Pirk |
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jhlurie
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posted on 9-7-2003 at 08:34 PM
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pirk
Demnos, jhlurie do you always stay in front of your screen to do this work?
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Unfortunately, yes. At some point in the future it would be nice to be able to rate them via a wireless keyboard and shortcut keys just for the
rating (a wireless mouse works, of course, but its too hard to see from that distance).
Perhaps... while the song is playing some combination of control keys and a number 0-9 can rate the song, since each half-star position can correspond
to a number, right? Also, the key to the immediate left of the 1 key can be used for a mark of zero, if needed.
Holding down some control key (whatever isn't being used for something else in eJ) plus the following number key across the keyboard...
key=rating
`=0 stars
1=1/2 star
2=1 star
3=1 1/2
4=2
5=2 1/2
6=3
7=3 1/2
8=4
9=4 1/2
0=5 stars
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Pirk
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posted on 9-7-2003 at 08:46 PM
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I will try to mend something with my eJukebox dedicated remote control using the program "PC Remote Control".
Unless I couple that with my applause-meter
Pirk |
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Pirk
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posted on 9-8-2003 at 03:53 PM
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OK, now I can do my ratings with my remote control.
I have also added some big OSD numbers (0 to 10) displayed right in the middle of my TV screen each time I rate a song, because the stars and half
stars aren't visible very well on the TV screen.
I'll be glad when the others .DIS files become!
Thanks.
Pirk |
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Spazz
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posted on 9-8-2003 at 07:45 PM
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Is it possible to use the rating system to filter out songs? Like use popular but don't play songs below 2 stars?
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Pirk
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posted on 9-8-2003 at 08:20 PM
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Open Player options/Play mode/Popularity mode/5 star...
Pirk |
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Spazz
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posted on 9-8-2003 at 09:46 PM
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The thing about the hybrid mode is that as far as I can tell it uses the or operator so they pick songs independantly from eachother.
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Spazz
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posted on 9-8-2003 at 09:48 PM
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Never mind, it's working now, I must be on crack or something
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Audiosoft
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posted on 9-8-2003 at 10:56 PM
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Hybrid mode will filter out songs that have less than the At-least star value on the 5 Stars playmode settings tab. (As long as those songs have been
given a start rating.)
Put simply: Hybrid mode currently uses your 5 Star settings to allow songs that have a star rating and your Pick count settings to allow songs without
a 5 star rating.
We will soon add an option to allow Hybrid mode to function with an AND operator so that you can have it only allow songs thats star rating and pick
count both match the playmode settings.
Audiosoft |
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Demnos
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posted on 9-9-2003 at 07:33 AM
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| Quote: |
Also, I wait for the "point 2" requested by Demnos!
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Well, after working with the rating system for a few days, I would have to say that the most important addition would not be this
"point 2" but to see the stars displayed together with the track names.
The most useful application is really that you want to listen to the best songs of a certain album but can't remember which tracks you like. If
we had a star listing displayed when clicking on the album, then we could immediately pick our favourites. This is especially important at parties,
where you quickly need to pick the best songs "under DJ stress", or even just when a friend comes to your house and you want to showcase the
highlights of a particular CD...
| Quote: | |
Demnos, jhlurie do you always stay in front of your screen to do this work? |
. I batch-rate them. I usually transfer a new album to
my portable player and listen to it on my way to work. I rename the songs on the player to include a rating. Then when I come home, I take 3 minutes
to "transfer" the rating from my portable to the eJukebox database.
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Pirk
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posted on 9-9-2003 at 04:37 PM
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Absolutely!
I've talked of your "Point 2" because I think, for the time being, it's the most easy to do. But you are right, it's not the
best use possible of stars when we reason in term of albums...
Of course stars beside each song in the Songlist would be a precious help to do one's choice among the songs of an album.
Moreover it was for the same use I haved asked for faded stars representing popularity of songs.
At parties, that's just the most popular songs of the album you need to know... in order to do THE good choice!
So, since nobody want faded stars, we could display the Pick count instead, beside the ratings, i.e:
Song 1 [75 14x]
Song 2 [60 10x]
Song 3 [20 3x]
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Cool, no? I think nobody is opposed to that? 
I hope Audiosoft will plan to add both.
Otherwise, I see that you are very crafty for your ratings!
Pirk |
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jhlurie
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posted on 9-13-2003 at 09:16 PM
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pirk
OK, now I can do my ratings with my remote control.
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Pirk, how? I'm assuming, of course, that the Program you are using is able to batch keystrokes to a Remote Control button. But what keystrokes
are you using to equate to picking a star value? The suggestions I gave above were theoretical keys for a future version.
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Pirk
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posted on 9-14-2003 at 08:38 AM
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Yes, the program I use -PC Remote Control (or Girder if you prefer...)- is able to batch keystrokes, BUT NOT ONLY. You can also batch the mouse, to
within 1 pixel!
It's easy to record some predefined movements and clicks. Thus you can assign a touch (0-10) of your remote for each rating position on the now
playing panel (0-5 star).
Pirk |
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stsirois
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posted on 9-15-2003 at 12:37 AM
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Very cool, Pirk! What resolution are you running at? Given that all other Windows display settings are equal, if you provided us with your pixel
points or Girder file, other users should be able to use your Girder file with maybe only minor adjustments.
Thanks,
Steve
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Pirk
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posted on 9-15-2003 at 07:47 AM
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Hi Steve,
The resolution not change anything. I run at 1024x768 on my computer and at 800x600 on my TV. It's equal. There is just a small restriction at
1024x768 you need to keep the eJ window at the top left corner of your screen during your ratings.
I could possibly give you the points if you want. But really it's easy to find them yourself. The program is well done. When you move the mouse
over the stars their exact coordinates are displayed in the configuration box of "PC Remote Control".
Otherwize, I never tried this with Girder because I don't use this program, but I think that should be the same.
Thanks.
Pirk |
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